While I do feel that small charges for premium content are a viable way for developers to offset rising costs without continuing to inflate price points, it was pretty rude of me to insult the community behind the large-scale boycott of EA's Bad Company. Calling them names instead of aiming for dialog and fair discussion of issues kinda flies in the face of my principles, and I regret that. This is why I ought not to post on my vacation!So firstly, I want to publicly apologize to that community. I reached out to the folks at Sarcastic Gamer to try and better understand their concerns -- not because some angry people left comments on my original post, because that type of behavior actually proves my negative points, but because I figure that if what I'd said was a bit unfair, it was best to amend it by allowing these folks to explain their point of view.
One interesting point that I gleaned from my discussions with Lono, the editor of Sarcastic Gamer, is that part of the concern for the boycotters lies in the fact that Bad Company is an FPS. While premium content might work well in open-world multiplayer games, I can definitely understand the fear that separating the haves from the have-nots in a genre where equipment is king might create sincere and possibly viable concerns about game balance.
I'm all for developers exploring new revenue streams with the aim of developing alternatives to the wallet-crushing retail price points, but this might not have been the right sort of introduction. I wonder -- might it have been better received if EA had released the game with 20 guns and then released bonus weapons as DLC further down the line? Who knows?
Anyway, though, while I stand by my opinion, there was no need for me to insult people when their viewpoint is certainly as viable as my own, and that was rather wrongheaded of me. So, to present the other side of the coin, here's my interview with Lono from Sarcastic Gamer, who the site's director of operation tells me is the brains behind the boycott:
Under EA's proposed model for Bad Company, users could pay for extra content as an enhancement to their gaming experience, or decline to buy extras if they're not as into the game. Why do you think this is wrong?
I think the model exploits gamers by first selling them an incomplete game at full price and then charging them additionally to make them whole. Let me explain. Battlefield: Bad Company is a shooter, right? Well, one of the draws of the game is its multiplayer experience. However, the game is shipping to retail with only five guns per faction. This is unheard of. EA has already playtested the additional 10 weapons, but are refusing to include them in the retail version. Why? To sell them for an additional fee. As a result, in my opinion, the retail version is gimped. It's not what it should be by design in order to make more money off of the rabid gamers that are eager to play the game. Just because you can charge for the additional content, doesn't always make it right.
We also believe that the additional weapons that are only available for a fee will unbalance the game, regardless of what EA's PR people say. Anytime you introduce a new "something" to a competitive multiplayer game, that is only available to those that can afford it, the balance will be upset. That's why we think this is wrong.
I think the model exploits gamers by first selling them an incomplete game at full price and then charging them additionally to make them whole. Let me explain. Battlefield: Bad Company is a shooter, right? Well, one of the draws of the game is its multiplayer experience. However, the game is shipping to retail with only five guns per faction. This is unheard of. EA has already playtested the additional 10 weapons, but are refusing to include them in the retail version. Why? To sell them for an additional fee. As a result, in my opinion, the retail version is gimped. It's not what it should be by design in order to make more money off of the rabid gamers that are eager to play the game. Just because you can charge for the additional content, doesn't always make it right.
We also believe that the additional weapons that are only available for a fee will unbalance the game, regardless of what EA's PR people say. Anytime you introduce a new "something" to a competitive multiplayer game, that is only available to those that can afford it, the balance will be upset. That's why we think this is wrong.
Why do you think the community feels so strongly about this? Why pick this particular issue as an opportunity to make your voice heard to a large game company?
We feel strongly about this because of our past experience with other video games of the same type. We were all very interested in Battlefield: Bad Company and our prior coverage of the game on our site showed it. When we found out that EA had chosen to gimp the game to resell it back to gamers, well, we'd had enough. We are not interested in EA testing this somewhat new model of increasing their revenue. We believe that when video game companies sell their wares to the public, that the buyer get the full product. That's not happening here, and a lot of people agree with us.
Would you prefer that everyone gets the same version of the game for a higher price than the common $60 price point -- i.e, premium version is the only version?
That is certainly an option, however, EA doesn't really believe that it's viable, and I don't either. Look, video games are expensive and to charge more than 60 bucks for a video game is too much in my opinion. For EA to charge 70 bucks for a game that pales in comparison to Call of Duty 4, that's being sold for $60 with twice as many maps and play types, would mean death for BF:BC.
My (maybe naive) theory is that if a pay-for-extras business model takes off, it could lower the costs of "basic games", and then users could add value as they like with add-ons. Would the community be more amenable to this as an alternative payment model if the cost of basic games was lowered as a result?
People thought the same thing of in-game advertising. That hasn't happened and there's no reason to believe that it would happen here too. But that's not what EA is doing. There taking the model you've described, but charging full price. If BF:BC was 30 bucks instead, we probably wouldn't have as big of a problem with it. We have no problem with Battlefield: Heroes, because it's free.
If you believe players should all have access to the same equipment regardless of money, what would you say, though, to players who don't want extras and want to be able to pay a price that reflects only the content they will use?
We don't represent those players, and personally, I don't believe that they exist. If they do exist, they represent a small minority of players. God love 'em.
Do you think the format of the game -- in this case, FPS -- has any effect on what business models the community is willing to accept? Do you think that paid extras or tiered subscriptions or any other situation in which players pay for more than basics would work in a game where the range of equipment, special items and what have you, is more diverse, like something more MMO-like?
I think that because the game is an FPS there is such a strong reaction. FPS games are much , much more competitive than the other game types you've described.
How do you hope EA will respond to the community? Anything else you want to say?
I just want to thank you for the opportunity to answer a few of your questions and allowing us at Sarcastic gamer the opportunity to reach out those fans of your blog that may not have otherwise known of our boycott.
As for EA, please understand that I am personally a HUGE Battlefield fanboy. That's probably why I got so amped up about this. I just can't let it slide, when I know I can, at least try to do something about it.
In the end, I hope they respond and decide to ship all 15 weapons in the $60 retail box. Charging for maps is one thing, charging for weapons, we feel, is another. Look, we don't "hate" EA, I mean, it's a video game for chrissakes. We're not trying to cure cancer here or anything and we realize that. We just don't believe in what they're doing and we're just trying to make our issues known. Who'd have known that so many people agreed with us?
Thanks Leigh! Say hi to Peter Moore at the Christmas party for us. Let me know what new tatoo's he's sporting at the party... Kidding.
----
For the record, I don't know Peter Moore nor do I have any relationship with EA beyond dealing with their public relations staff for my job. If you feel strongly against this monetization strategy by EA, I would encourage you to join Sarcastic Gamer's boycott, as even where I don't agree, I can always respect the power of the gaming community to unify as a single voice on issues they care about.
More effective, though? Just don't buy it. I guarantee you that'll send the message you want.
[Update: Apparently, it worked?]
28 comments:
Thanks Leigh! Your quick response shows us that you're a class act. Albeit a class act that hates "obnoxious dweebs..." LOL.
Oh, c'mon, let it go! :)
"So firstly, I want to publicly apologize to that community. I reached out to the folks at Sarcastic Gamer to try and better understand their concerns -- not because some angry people left comments on my original post, because that type of behavior actually proves my negative points, but because I figure that if what I'd said was a bit unfair, it was best to amend it by allowing these folks to explain their point of view."
I don't speak for that community, but apology accepted from me.
As for your above paragraph my dad, who was a Navy Seal Commander, used to say something to me often about arguing and I think it applies here, "Don't start no $W%*&& and there won't be any #$&%$."
I agree with you about the "pay for extras" monetization strategy to an extent. However, I don't think it's a "one size fits all" solution to the rising cost of game development.
Let me elaborate. With the exception of horse armor, I have every piece of DLC released for The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion. Each and every piece of DLC pulled me back into the game and added more value to the purchase. It also prevented me from selling the game. I spent just about $50 on DLC for that game, and I don't regret one red cent of it.
There's also a wrong way to do DLC. When you're making a complete game, and then locking parts of it off, as EA does in many of their sports titles, to sell at a later date, that's just greedy. Think of it like this. Let's say you go to a car dealership to buy a brand new car. You look at one on the show room floor that really appeals to you. After signing all the papers and driving it off the lot you turn on the radio only to realize that no sound is coming out of the speakers. So, naturally you return to the dealership, where they tell you that "for an additional fee, we can connect the speakers and make your new car complete".
Cheap or free basic games with additional content for sale isn't inherently a bad idea at all, but it has to be done right. You can't try and capitalize on creating an imbalance in multiplayer - it will absolutely suck all the good will right out of the gaming community, and it seems that's exactly what EA is trying to do here.
"More effective, though? Just don't buy it. I guarantee you that'll send the message you want."
Yeah, Leigh. That's pretty much what a game boycott is. People banding together in a movement to not buy a game. But it does have another point. If the whole world just didn't buy the game when it came out, EA would wonder wtf happened. The point to making a public boycott is to give EA a chance to fix it. If they fix it, we'll buy it. If they don't, we will vote with our wallets and not buy the game. As Lono said, we're not hating on EA. EA puts out a lot of games that I like to play. I just want them to listen to their customers when we say, "No, don't cross that line".
I'm a Sarcastic Gamer fan. My respect for you has been restored. Thanks for getting together with Lono and posting this. Enjoy the rest of your vacation.
WTG -- Yeah, I'm understanding now the distinctions that make this a problem for people. It is a complicated issue.
Saccia -- I think that's actually an interesting strategy, trying to give the company a chance to make amends with the community. I'll be interested to see how and whether EA responds.
Lono... can we invite her to Gamernight?
First of all, I echo what Lono says: I respect you quickly re-examining your statements and hashing it out with Lono. Pure class.
Back to the topic.
The only place I can see the microtransaction model working is in RPGs and MMORPGs. In those situations as long as content can stand by itself and the exclusion of such content from the retail game doesn't diminish the experience, expansion packs and other DLC is a great way to release extra content that's not ready at the time the game ships.
And, my response to your original post:
EA will NOT reduce the base price of their console games to make way for microtransactions.
The majority of the industry doesn’t follow this business model (small base price + lots of microtransactions), so why would EA feel pressured to reduce the base price of the games?
EA is a business, and their first priority is serving their shareholders, not the gamers. They won’t make concessions unless they’re forced to.
Leigh, sarcasticgamer actually introduced me to your blog, so all is not in vain;)
I had too much to say in response to the discussion so I just responded via:
http://games.uber.com/blogs/How_much_should_videogames_cost.html
Short version- love the debate, huge competitive FPS player, don't see the issue besides for it being a game that starts off costing 10 bucks more because of pre-existing DLC.
So it just sounds and feels like a boycott over 10 bucks. *shrug* To each their own.
-UG
PS- The sarcasticgamer guys are good people, they just get a little "into it" at times;)
I understand why people can be upset about it to a degree. It seems like EA is ripping them off. But EA sees what I see, FPS fanatics are like golfers (and this aside from the weird psychosexual gimics of teabagging or screaming get in the hole). EA saw PC FPS player willing to spend $600 on a graphics card to up their resolution and FPS by insanely small amounts. They saw them pay $100 for a mouse and another $100 for a keyboard to play. So just like golfers not only would they pay to play, they spend foolish amounts of money on equipment to play. Why not be in on that gravy train?
@ Robert
We play CONSOLE GAMES. We do that so we don't have to upgrade every six months!
@ Leigh
I am also a first time viewer of your blog. I LIKES!!! I appreciate your coverage and the subsequent apology. The more this word gets out the better.
I personally don't care about this game but I care about this principle. Lono hit the nail right on the head. EA told us 4 or 5 years ago that in game advertising would help cut retail sale prices, and IT HAS NOT DONE THAT ONE BIT! We all pay $60 for a game and they still try to get more by selling us guns that they are developing within the game! WACK
@ Lono
You rock dude! LAUGH MONKEY
Yay, all is well! Hope you guys stick around and continue the discussion.
I love you, Leigh. It's posts like these that make SVGL one of my favorite blogs.
Before I realized this post existed, I was concocting a counterargument to Bad Company's Big Idea on my own blog. Now, I'm arguing to no one. Ah well, here's the link if anyone's interested:
http://amoskowitz.blogspot.com/2008/04/among-bad-company.html
Lono said: "Anytime you introduce a new 'something' to a competitive multiplayer game, that is only available to those that can afford it, the balance will be upset. That's why we think this is wrong."
In real life, people often have an advantage if they have money. [Oh blessed abridged Yu-Gi-Oh! series: "Screw the rules, I have money!"] Couldn't someone who has a much better internet connection or much better computer also have an advantage in a FPS? I am not saying that they do, I'm just asking the question.
I understand that one of the big draws to any sort of online game is that you all start on the same level, you all start out equal which is something that does not happen in real life, but when one region gets a game before another region and they can play on the same server, doesn't region 1 have an advantage for some amount of time? And are these new guns are, in fact, better? Or are they simply different?
Say person X has no job so he can play a game 40 hours a week but not buy the new guns. And then take person Y who works 40 hours a week and doesn't have a huge amount of time to play, but has the money to buy newer (and maybe better) guns. Does person Y really have an advantage? I mean, unless you bought an atomic bomb, I highly doubt an inexperienced player will be able to dominate experienced players. A gun may get you a cheap kill or 3, but skill will win in the end, won't it?
Is it really just an issue of "those who can afford it" or is it also a bit of "those who are willing to pay for it". If you are already paying for an xbox360, the game (and I understand that in this case you are unlocking data already on the disc, but for my question let us pretend it is new content downloaded from the server after the games release), xbox live, and an internet connection and you simply cannot afford another couple bucks for a gun..well, I find that a little bit suspicious. I am not saying that just because you are already paying a lot means you should be expected to pay more, but your previous purchase history shows that you are more likely than not to be able to pay more. This may be something that EA is counting on because yes, they are a business.
Now this is not to say that EA's approach is the correct approach, but there is some validity to this general path especially as digital sales increase and digital games are offered for less. Yes, the base game price in this case has not gone down because of this, but as Leigh said maybe they need to see the reaction that comes from this before they can justify lowering the game price.
And maybe they have no intention of lowering prices, but the bubble is getting a little big and consumers don't like the trend of big budget games meaning big price tags. Is this their way of making it look like the game prices haven't increased by making you pay more for the whole game/ungimped version? I certainly hope not.
But I like to be hopeful in this case and hope that it is a stepping ground to cheaper games, letting me buy features as I see fit. After all, it's kinda like TaxCut software...you can buy the cheap version or you can buy the premium version that already has the e-file fee in there. Either way, if I want to e-file/more guns, I gotta pay the greater amount, either up front or later.
[Please note that all "you"s are the general you, not any specific person]
I am glad to see that you have given a second look to your obvious misrepresentation of our community. I was really offended by your lack of investigation of our boycott before you decided to slam us.
"I reached out to the folks at Sarcastic Gamer to try and better understand their concerns -- not because some angry people left comments on my original post, because that type of behavior actually proves my negative points"
that is a ridiculous statement, that says you aren't really sorry about your comments you just don't want to look like an idiot for not finding out why we think the way we do. I am glad to say that i can now know that I dont have to take anything you blog about seriously because it is obviously your biased pokemon opinion. You obviously dont play FPS games so you really shouldn't even comment on something that you clearly dont have idea what you are talking about. Please stick to talking about thinks you know , before you humiliate yourself any farther and ruin your self proclaimed reputation in the gaming community.
Hey Leigh, PMPB here from Sarcastic Gamer.
I have stopped by on occasion to read your posts and their always great. Myself and the rest of the staff at SG are an easily excitable, sarcastic bunch (especially when something we feel strongly about is involved) and those tendencies transfer directly to our fans.
I totally understand and respect your opinion on this matter and the fact that you have been so nice about things has only raised my appreciation of your blog even more.
Wish ya nothin but the best,
PMPB
I think now that you have apologized i think it is fair to say I might give this blog a fair try, and take a look around.
Leigh, you're always welcome at our Worldwide Sarcastic Gamer Night, and check out Leigh on the SG Podcast next week.
"I dont have to take anything you blog about seriously because it is obviously your biased pokemon opinion."
Personally, I like your pokemon opinion. If not for you, I'd never have caught Mewto (He's just so damn elusive!).
It's hard for anyone to admit they slipped up, let alone in the gaming community where we pride ourselves on an extravagant knowledge of what's hot, what's not, what's right, and what's wrong. But to hand over the podium, and give the other party a chance to speak, well, that's tough. Toughbook tough.
Plus, this particular blog's updated with care multiple times a week for no pay. If I were Leigh, I wouldn't have slipped up, I would have gone mad. She's updating on vacation--she's off her rocker.
So kudos.
Oh, and...
Hot - Halo Map Pack
Not - Six Axis
Right - Jeremy Parish
Wrong - Pikachu's down+b
Leigh-I'm glad to see you've recanted certain parts of your last post; as a sometime SVGL reader I found it uncharacteristic and disappointing. But I'll keep coming back given this one.
As far as the idea of weapons costing extra: If they don't unbalance gameplay I don't see the problem...but then again if they don't affect gameplay, I can't imagine them being worth buying, so that would seem to put economics and gameplay at an impasse there. And if EA were to say "well the purchasable weapons are better for a given play style" then the game effectively penalizes anyone who uses that play style, which is unacceptable.
Now I haven't played the game (of coruse), and TBH I don't know too much about it. Nor am I a big Battlefield fan. But I do think that if the DLC model is going to be taken further, the base game has to be priced appropriately as well, and if important or significant amounts of content are to be bought separately, prices for the game itself have to come down to reflect the decrease in base content.
Oh, and to the argument that it's unjust/wrong to charge for something already on the disk: No. It is a bit ridiculous and silly, but there's nothing "wrong" with it. There is no moral or ethical difference between charging for something on the disk, or charging to allow a download, as long as the disk's price reflects the available content rather than total content. So if they charge you twice for something, yes that's wrong. But if they charge you for it once, it doesn't make a difference if it's being unlocked or downloaded.
To anyone outraged/upset over the previous hooplah: I'm sorry this was your introduction to the blog, but as a reader I encourage you to give it a second chance. I've found it to be worthwhile.
Oh, and about voting with your wallet: while it may be somewhat effective, it is flawed in that not purchasing something doesn't tell the creator/distributer why. So here's a thought: devs and publishers could have a feature online, where people can say "I'm not buying x because". I know this is already communicated, but that would make it easier/faster.
I guess I'm boycotting the game too because I just don't care about it. I can totally understand why they are up in arms though, it worries me too.
Personally knowing that a game has more costs at birth is a turn off and I'm unlikely to buy it. But knowing that the game is continued to be worked on afterwards and is updated is a plus.
I'm torn and it brings up so many issues.
PMPB, Lono, and others -- thanks for being forgiving. No hard feelings on my end either; in a way, it's good your community is "excitable." Means they care a lot :)
My fear is that companies will just reduce existing game content without reducing the price at all or not enough.
This can mean getting a worse experience off a game with the same money or just a bit less than the price you actually pay now. At the same time paying eventually more through microtransactions for content you would have gotten anyway in standardised product.
We have seen that DLC via XBLA has been abused by some companies already. So i think although there is no need to panic the concerns amongst gamers are somewhat justified until we see how companies actually do this.
Leigh, as a longtime reader I'd like to see a more careful examination of DLC on your part.
Personally although I support DLC wholeheartedly when it comes to Rock Band and other full price games that come out with expansion items after the fact for additional price, I think publishers have to be very careful to avoid the implication that they're deliberately holding back content in order to charge more for it later.
Keep in mind games like Armageddon Empires and Sins of a Solar Empire use free expansions to help de-incentivize piracy, while other games may release at a different price point and sell additional content. The pricing model for games is in flux right now, and some game publishers seem (in the eyes of this audience, at least) to be pushing the envelope as far as it will stretch. What happens down the road, when we try to transfer DLC to our XBOX 720 or PS4? Ultimately a lot is still up in the air. Community reaction, although it won't determine the success of games like Bad Company, may help to inform publishers if their game doesn't do as well as expected.
Competitive multiplayer games are especially sensitive to balance issues, and this DLC seems to create one. DLC for slightly different models of the same gun wouldn't matter in the least, as long as it's just 'bling,' but when it has any impact on the multiplayer community it has impact on the game people bought.
Finally I'd like to point out I'm a little hurt by the 'My Life as a King' DLC - basically I went from a day one adopter to a 'wait for the review' purchaser. Paying for additional races and buildings - at this point, having no idea whether this will impact gameplay or not, I don't want to take a chance. When pricing strategies increase audience uncertainty this way they damage the sale of a product. Of course, MLK was guaranteed such a huge success at launch IMO perhaps they added the question mark in order to decrease the load on their servers...
Micropayments are the fucking devil. Give EA et al an inch, and they will take a mile.
Like I said, it doesn't really matter what we think of it or whether it's fair or not. The fact is, games do and always have existed on a steady curve of price inflation. Development budgets are huge, and to keep developing franchises, to innovate on familiar formats, or to expand into new technology -- the way we keep demanding game companies should -- budgets are going to get bigger.
Not so very long from now, games will end up ringing up at $80 bucks. Game companies know we won't pay that, or fewer of us will. So pay-for-DLC at the very least lets consumers have more control over how much they want to spend, and offers an incentive for developers to make games more appealing to us. It also gives games a "longer tail" in the market, reducing risk.
It isn't about what's "right" or "wrong." I don't like it either -- who wants to spend more money?
But it's simple economics, not a moral issue. Game companies need to monetize content in a way that makes it worth the risk to produce it. Period.
I'm not saying "this is good" versus "this is bad." I'm saying, "this is how it is, and we need to figure out what compromises we are and aren't willing to make."
My hope is eventually that new biz models will open the market to more competition, further innovation and lower costs, even if the industry has some wrong turns on the way at first.
And that is totally my final word on that in this context, although I am really interested in exploring it from a gameplay experience when My Life as a King comes out.
Mircrotransactions will be the way of the future. Base games will be sold especially those published for PC use, and players will have the ability to purchase add-ons to enhance and personalize their experience. This is already widely popular. If you don't like it, just don't participate and purchase anything.
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